What Are Gender Pronouns & How To Use Them

Everyone deserves to be addressed in a way that respects who they are.

Asserting gender pronouns is a great way to support inclusivity, fight against assumptions about gender, and create a safer environment for transgender, non-binary, and gender non-conforming folx. When starting off with using pronouns, there’s a bit of a learning curve, and it’s normal to have some discomfort and nerves.

In this episode, I break down what pronouns are, why they matter, how to use them, and what to do if you mess up. I also discuss the psychology behind resistance to pronoun usage and the prevalence that I’m seeing leading companies encourage and normalize their use. Through learning more about pronouns, you’ll feel more comfortable giving them a try, helping to support gender inclusivity. 

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Show Notes:

Eric:

(Intro)

Welcome to the Be Proud With Eric podcast, the place for all things Queer empowerment. I'm your host, Eric Sullivan, he/him pronouns. I'm a proud gay person, licensed therapist, and DEI consultant. My mission is to empower members of the LGBTQ+ community and teach people to be better. Allies. I love connecting with people, and I'm so glad you're here. Let's do this.

All right. This is my first recording in 2022. I am back on the mic and feeling excited about it. I have been working the past few months to get my new consulting business launched for those who have been following along. So I also was working on the podcast launch at that same time. It turned out to be a little bit too much. I was getting overwhelmed, so I opted to take a little breather on the podcast, get my company launched. That has since happened. And now here we are again. So I am excited to be reconnecting with everyone. I know with my, um, therapy sessions this past week, it seems like a lot of people were in a bit of a slump. I think part of that was the holidays, the weather. There's so much stress around the end of the year.

And what I was seeing was this combination of people who were really excited to start working on their new year's goals, but they weren't there yet. It was like the conceptualization was happening, the ideas were starting to form, but they didn't quite yet want to take action on it, which I kind of related to.

It took a little bit to get out of that funk from the holidays this year. But here we are 2022, new year, new me. Let's do this.

Today. I'm going to be talking about pronouns. What they are, why they're important, how to use them, and what to do if you mess up. So pronouns, AKA gender pronouns, but the term gender pronouns, one, it's a bit redundant.

It's a bit technical and it's not the way that they're used in everyday conversation. Especially amongst Queer spaces. People don't often say my gender pronouns are XYZ, or what are your gender pronouns? We usually just say pronouns. One thing to note, as we get started, asserting pronouns has gotten a lot of traction in recent time, especially during the pandemic.

We'll talk about why that was, but asserting pronouns is not something that's new to inclusive Queer spaces, not all Queer spaces, and some took longer to get there. Sharing what your pronouns are in an introduction and Queer spaces has been around for some time. I can't exactly remember the very first time that I was in a space and we were asked to do this or like that.

I learned like, oh, that's what pronouns are. Or these are how they were. My grad program was in LGBTQ+ plus psychology. So it was definitely sometime during then, but I don't remember if it was like the first day of classes. This was about 12 years ago. What I do remember distinctly the first time that I can like vividly remember someone saying we're going to share what our pronouns are.

Was while I was in grad school, I was volunteering and co-facilitating a support group for a Queer male identified youth in Los Angeles. And this was through the youth branch of the Los Angeles LGBT center, which fun fact is the world's largest resource provider to LGBTQ+ people. So I got to work there when I was in grad school.

I did my clinical rotation there and I also volunteered there and I loved it. So I was co-facilitating this Queer, it was called the Queer Boys Youth Group at LifeWorks, the youth branch. And while I was training and sitting in on a session to start, the facilitator said, we're going to get started by introducing ourselves and sharing our pronouns.

And I knew what it meant, but I had never seen it done before. And so it's just kind of a neat way to see like, oh, okay, cool. This is how it works. You say your name and then you say what your pronouns are and you just keep going around. And now everyone knows how to refer to you when not using your name.

It's interesting seeing this play out like modern day. It's become a lot more prevalent and you can see sometimes people get nervous when they're like, oh gosh, pronouns. What's that? And what am I in again? And what's the right way to use this. So that's one of the reasons I want to talk about this today is so that people are more in the know.

And so that they'll feel more comfortable cause you will be in positions where you'll be asked to use your pronouns. This way you can think about that in advance and know why that is and why that's important and be better prepared for that. So to start, what are pronouns pronouns are how a person is referred to when their name isn't being used. For by grammar people out there, this would be the singular third person way to refer to someone.

So for example, my pronouns are, he/him. So someone might say, Eric is recording his new podcast today. And in that sentence, they used my name, Eric. And when they were referring to me not using my name, they used a pronoun, which once that was, he was, that was say, I think, and that said did so some examples of pronouns.

He/him/his, she/her/hers. they/them/theirs. Sometimes when people are saying their pronouns, they'll give the full thing, he/him, his or I, I feel like more commonly nowadays, people are just saying the first two, my pronouns, are he/him. The other one's not going hurt. Right. It's good information to have, but it's might be not necessary.

And it makes it shorter and easier. Just say the first. So those were some options of pronouns that can be used. These aren't all of them. There's tons of pronouns out there. And if somebody uses a set of pronouns that you're not familiar with, that's okay. It's okay to ask and it's okay to clarify. This even happens to me sometimes, especially like if I'm in a dedicated Queer space and someone might feel safer to say their pronouns, that they might not say in all spaces, because people aren't familiar with them.

So if that happens, if somebody says my pronouns are blank and you're not sure what those are. It's okay to clarify it, to make sure you're know how to say it and know how to pronounce them so that in conversation you'll be able to do so I don't spend too much time on it. You know what I mean? I might, if they say their pronouns, I might say, I want to make sure I'm getting it and say them back.

And then if they're like, yes, I'm like, cool. And then I move on and then make it a point to practice using them in conversation. Now, some people do not use pronouns at all. If somebody says no pronouns, that means just use their name. So anytime you would usually fill that in with that singular third pronoun, just use their name the entire time Eric left his book at school.

Eric is going to go back for it when Eric is ready. Some people also use a combination of pronouns. So somebody might say my pronouns are he/they. That means that they're comfortable with both of those pronouns and that both of those can be used in any order. Somebody might say my pronouns are they/she, my pronouns, are he/her.

Right? Like they're suggesting that all of those pronouns are acceptable to use for them. Someone also might say, I'm comfortable with all pronouns. I will often say my pronouns are he/him, and I'm comfortable with any that are used respectfully. Because that's true. I am. If somebody uses a different gender for me, especially in a Queer space, I'm comfortable with it.

Um, sometimes that's like a part of Queer culture to do that. And I remember when I was facilitating one of my youth groups back in the day, and I said that I kind of like modeled that for my youth. I said, my pronouns are he/him, and I'm comfortable with any that are used respectfully. And one of the other gay male identified youth in the group said, okay, girl.

And then he was like, I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. Like he thought he did something wrong and I was like, no, it's cool. That's fine. And he was like, oh, okay. Awesome. And technically, I mean, that wasn't a pronoun him saying, okay girl, but you know, whatever, it's still, you know, it kind of landed and it was neat to see like that he thought he was gonna get in trouble for doing that.

And that not only was I like, no, that's perfectly okay. But I kind of liked it. I kind of thought it was fun and it was playful. And like I wanted to show him no, that's okay to say as long as somebody is comfortable with it, you don't want to say, Hey girl, to somebody. I don't like it, but if they say it's okay that you can go for it.

So let's talk about the singular, they/them pronoun. I have done many trainings over the years, and this has been a part of my training when explaining pronouns and the importance of using them. And what I noticed and still see today is that a lot of people struggle with they/them pronouns and the singular they/them.

Now, and often the, the reason cited is grammar. People would say like grammatically, it's not correct to use a singular they pronoun, they refers to multiple people. So first of all, I love grammar too. I would always give that to them. I'm like, I'm all for grammar. You know, I'm a stickler for it too, but here's the thing.

Historically, we have used a singular they/them conversationally for a long time. This is nothing new. Like if you're in a meeting space and somebody leaves and you see a backpack, is there, what do you say? You say somebody left their backpack, right? Because you don't know who it is. You don't know that person's gender and people use a singular they/them and the form of their backpack. So one that kind of didn't fly even back then. I'm like, okay. Even if technically it's not correct, grammatically, it's still used all the time. So like, uh, I don't know if that one's going to fly now. Here's the other thing. Grammar is a construct. Right. It's a set of just kind of made up rules that people have decided for the way that we use language.

And so even though at that time, technically yes, a singular they/them was not correct grammatically, I would say what if it was? What if that changed? Like language is always subject to change and it does. So what if that construct changed and it was deemed to be correct? And it was interesting because oftentimes they would say, ehhhh no I still couldn't do it in my mind it would still be wrong. And so then I would usually say something like, okay, well then it's not actually about grammar for you. It's probably about something else. That might be worth taking a look at. Guess what else to all those out there that feel the same way, or have said that?

Miriam Webster has spoken. They officially declared the singular day as correct in September of 2019. So we're now into 2022. That was a few years ago at this point. And not only that. In 2021, they named the singular they as their word of the year based on data, including the number of searches that are used for the singular they for them, for their database, and the way that it was used in 2021 and how prevalent it was and how normalized it had become.

So they/them. It's here. It's correct. It's used. Get on board. Now let's talk about why pronouns are important to start. They are a basic level of respect in knowing how to refer to a person when you're talking about that. As a therapist who specializes in working with the Queer community, I work with a lot of trans, non binary, and gender nonconforming people.

So I hear the stories every day of the pain that it causes the harm that it causes on members of those communities when they are mis-gendered. I also get to hear the joy that can happen. The euphoria, that can happen. The validation that can happen when someone gets gendered correctly. So while this might not seem like that big of a deal to you, and maybe that's a reason that you haven't engaged in knowing about and using pronouns in the past, know that this is particularly important for gender nonconforming people.

It's important to their safety. It's important to their personhood. It's important to their mood. It's important to their self-esteem. It matters. So if you're cisgender, which means the opposite of transgender. So if transgender means your gender does not align with your biological sex, cis-gender means that your gender does align with your biological sex.

So I am cisgender. As a cisgender person, if I opt not to use pronouns for various reasons, that's an example of me exerting privilege. Right? Cause cis-gender people don't often have to use pronouns, but if we opt not to, just because we don't have to, that's a prime example of privilege that we hold, and in doing so we are not helping to elevate marginalized communities and we are certainly not working toward inclusion.

So, not only is this a fundamental level of respect, it's also a pretty easy ask. Like I get that people have apprehension to using them. I hear about it all the time through the work that I do. And I also hear second hand about my gender nonconforming clients and the apprehensions of their loved ones in using them.

So I'm not saying there aren't reasons people don't, and we're going to talk about that and address that, but really at the end of the day, it's not that big of a deal. It's really not that hard to do. And it's not that hard to try at least. Now, as I mentioned, I'm cisgender. And so I hold cisgender privilege, including I'm typically perceived as, and read as male when interacting with others, which does align up with my gender.

But pronouns are not just for the trans community, the non binary community and gender nonconforming folks. It's really important for us as cis-gender or cis people to normalize the use of pronouns. Side note here. It's not preferred pronouns that her mom was used more widely a few years ago. I still see it being used sometimes today.

And even though it's well-intentioned, I think people mean it cause they're trying to say it's their, you know, it's their preference. It's what they want people to use for them. It's actually harmful because there's a connotation there that someone's pronouns are options. Generally the word preference suggests that it's what someone would like to have happen, but that it's not mandatory.

So if you use the word preferred with pronouns, it diminishes their importance and it can help people who aren't comfortable using them to opt out, because it might suggest to them that accurately gendering someone is optional. So if it's just a preference, I don't have to do. Now some people out there think, well, I don't have to ask somebody what their pronouns are.

I just know, I can just know by looking at them, I know what their pronouns are. That is really problematic. Why? You're reinforcing a harmful notion that you can tell someone's gender by looking at them. That is not true. If you think that that is not. That's based on stereotypes, that's based on norms about gender and it's based on this set of criteria that kind of arbitrarily been decided, this decides what someone's gender is. So even when your assumption is correct, even if you think you know what someone's pronouns are, and then that turns out to be correct, that's still harmful. Because you're still reinforcing the notion that you knew that because of certain things about that person. Now, what happens if someone who holds that criteria does not line up with the gender that you think they are.

Right. So it's problematic and it doesn't always work. Also keep in mind that someone's pronouns are not indicative of their gender. That's not a correlation there. So if somebody tells you what their gender is, don't automatically assume what their pronouns are based on that. And if someone tells you what their pronouns are, don't then assume their gender.

If I tell someone that my gender is male, that does not automatically mean that my pronouns are he/him, my gender could be male, my pronouns could be they/them, for example. My gender could be non binary, my pronouns could be she/her. Now also notice what I was saying that I was saying that if a person tells you their gender, don't make assumptions.

If a person tells you their pronouns, don't make assumptions. A singular their, right? That's nothing new. That's not because I'm like, yes, Miriam Webster said it's okay now that's cause that's just how people talk.

Okay. Let's talk about how to use pronouns now that you know what they are. How do you use them? So one great way to start is you can model your pronouns when you're introducing yourself. For example, hi, I'm Eric. he/him pronouns. You can also say I use blank pronouns. You can say, I go by blank pronouns, but anytime you use your name, if you include your pronouns, that's a great way to practice doing it.

You're also modeling to that other person that you're talking to, I just shared that. And without saying it, you're sort of like, now it's your turn. Tell me that information as well. Often times that works. I would say anecdotally, if I preface an introduction by saying my name and pronouns, oftentimes it will tee that person up to do the same thing coming back.

If they don't or if they just don't say anything at all, right. If they're just kind of pausing and they're not sure whose turn it is and the conversation you can say, how about you? What are your name and pronouns people can usually do that. People generally have enough of an understanding of what pronouns are to be able to do that.

If not, if they're like, uh, what does that mean? I just give them a brief explanation. It's how you want someone to refer to you when they're not using your name. For example, he/him, she/her, they/them, and then usually they're like, oh, okay. Got it. And even if they're like, oh, okay then my pronouns, are she/her?

Like, even if they're not quite sure, oftentimes they're generally willing to try it if they do that. And you say, awesome. Cool. Thank you. Thanks for letting me know. If you are conducting a group and meeting where that's an established practice where everybody already knows, oh, okay. It's in short time, we're going to say our name and pronouns.

It's a good idea to give a brief explanation as to what pronouns are before you ask people to do it. Because againn, even though a lot of people know what pronouns are not everybody does. And they also don't exactly know the way that they're supposed to use them. And if we think about. People get anxious with introductions.

Anyway, they're like, Ugh, gosh, I have to speak in front of every one. And I have to say a fun fact and oh God, I don't want to do this. So people are already a little bit on edge. And so then if you're asking them to do something, they don't know how to do that is like spotlight on anxiety. So it's helpful to give a brief explanation.

If you are facilitating a meeting and you're like, okay, everyone, we're going to get started. Let's get started with some intros, everyone go around the room and say their name and pronouns for anyone who doesn't know your pronouns or how you want to be referred to when someone's not using your name.

For example, he/him, she/her, they/them. Any others that you might use. And the reason we do this as a company is this is a great way to avoid making assumptions about gender and to practice inclusivity. Bam. Right? There's a good amount of info there kind of clears up any answers. Why are we doing this?

Right? And also somebody who's new to that company and new to that space. You're also demonstrating, oh wow, they're doing this because they're making an effort for greater inclusion. Hopefully that feels good to you to work at a place that does that. Other ways to practice using pronouns. This has become a lot more prevalent during the pandemic.

Everything went virtual and now we're seeing pronouns popping up on email signatures and on people's display names on virtual meetings. This is a great way to assert your pronouns, especially while we're all meeting and communicating virtually. It just sorta like one, it it's a reminder there in case you forget, and if you need to, or want to reference that person during the meeting, you don't have to have any guesswork there.

So it's helpful for that. But if we back up a little bit too, you're just setting the stage. By demonstrating, Hey, I am making an effort to be more inclusive. I am doing this because I want people to know how to respectfully refer to me and I want to know how to respectfully refer to other people. And so if I do this, then hopefully they'll feel more comfortable doing it too. And we can all respect one another.

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One thing to note. Not everyone's comfortable sharing their pronouns. And sometimes that's for reasons that we might not know we'll doubt. And so I don't push too hard. If somebody seems apprehensive to share their pronouns, I let it go. Right. Because you don't know what's going on for that person. And for some people who are members of the trans community non-binary community or gender nonconforming, They may know what their pronouns are and have connection to them, but they might not feel comfortable sharing that with other people, especially if that space doesn't have demonstrated safety.

And if they don't know the ways in which that information is going to be used, or perhaps they don't know how that information is going to be shared with others, and maybe they don't want that to be widespread information. So that's a really difficult position to be in because. It's not deceitful. It's not dishonest, but I hear this sometimes from people that I work with who use different pronouns and don't yet want to assert that in public spaces, that doesn't feel good because it's like, oh, this sucks.

I know who I am and I want to be referred to correctly, but I don't have a level of safety yet in doing that. But I also don't want to feel like I'm lying. We're being deceitful by, by asserting a pronoun. That's not mine and that's not going to feel good to me. So perhaps they would rather just omit pronouns at all.

So somebody seems reticent to share their pronouns. Let it go. Don't push it. Now, if you have a hunch or something tips you off that they're not wanting to in an effort to be non-inclusive, that's certainly something to maybe take a look at and address separately privately with them. If they're like, I'm not sharing my pronouns, that's got a different vibe to it.

And that I think is worth following up with later and being like, Hey, so-and-so I wanted to check in, you know, you said you didn't want to share your pronouns. What was that about? Or like what's up. Okay. So like I've said. The prevalence of people asserting their pronouns and intros got a really big boom during the pandemic, everything was virtual everyone's meeting over zoom.

Everyone's seeing these things pop up. What are these pronouns? Right. And big major companies, all the tech company. They all made an effort to let it be known why that was. And they actually asked people to, Hey, what we're all meeting virtually, make sure to include your pronouns. And here's why. And so more and more people have been doing it more and more people are seeing in email signatures and.

The good news it's catching on. It's becoming more and more normalized. It's not, it's not this like, oh my gosh. Wow. They just said they're pronouns. Like they are so woke. No, it's kind of gotten to the point where it's pretty standardized in the professional world. And so it's starting to tip to where, if you don't include pronouns at your work setting, it doesn't really look good. Anecdotally, I would say like this past year, we'll say, or the past two years during the pandemic, the percentage of people who did include their pronouns on their display name, it seemed to correlate with what type of group was hosting the meeting.

In Queer specific spaces, pronouns are largely a staple. It doesn't mean that everyone in there is comfortable using them. That's actually kind of neat to see that play out. Sometimes in Queer specific spaces, people might feel more inclined to say, I don't, I don't want to mess this up. I really don't know what pronouns are and I'm not trying to be disrespectful.

I just don't know how to use them. That takes courage too, to acknowledge in a group setting like that. It's also more authentic to be able to be like, uh, I want to do this. Can you help me though? But if you are a member of the Queer community and you participate in Queer spaces, it's probably something that is not new to you.

It's pretty common there. I would say in spaces that value inclusion they're often encourage. And so like in professional meetings, I would say that I'm participating in, I would guess about, I would say 30 to 50% of people are including their pronouns. That's when they're there representing their company.

That's when it's like a company meeting now, just like a general virtual meeting, it varies a lot. For example, like a zoom call with friends, right? That was all the rage during the early days of the lockdown. There, I would say it's not quite as strong, maybe about 15% of people sort of in their personal meetings are using them.

And even sometimes that's a carry over from it's already set that way for, they use zoom for their job and they just leave it like that. Which I mean is good. Like if you're. If you're including your products and your professional zoom, but then if you're meeting with other people and taking them out, like no need, leave them in there.

It's also a conversation piece I've had that happen to me. Like when I did zoom calls with friends, they'd be like, oh, Eric, he/him, oh, is that a thing now? Or are we supposed to do that? You know? And I tell them, yes, here's why.

Now, because I've worked in DEI or diversity, equity and inclusion, I have really close relationships with other DEI champions, so I get to hear the things that are said behind closed doors. I get to hear things that executives say and higher up say that maybe they don't realize it's not okay to say, or they don't feel any hesitation in saying them.

And it's neat too, because some of my DEI colleagues LGBTQ+ plus is that their expertise. And so like, you know, I learned from them on what their expertise is. They learn from me and we also kind of share insider things, you know, like here's what they actually say about the stuff that you work on. So I had a colleague who, uh, I have a great relationship with who said, you know, here's the big, like I work for a leading company.

Do they try to encourage pronoun usage because they know it looks good. Yes. And behind closed doors, what did they say to me? The DEI director. Do we really have to do this whole pronoun thing? I'd like, it didn't shock me. It's not like, it's nothing that I hadn't heard, but I was like, oh, wow. In the sense that I was kind of surprised that this company in particular, who had done so many things to champion DEI. Even then somewhere along the way, someone at the top was like, did we really have to do this?

And Hey, I hear it also like in conversations too, I'm sure there's people out there that are like, I mean, I I'm listening and I hear him. It sounds like it's important, but do we really have to do this? Well, I don't know. Let's talk about it. So, you know, going back to the executives, it's a prime example of a company positioning, DEI as a core value because they know it looks good and they know that it looks bad if you aren't a champion of inclusion.

And so many companies have created these DEI director positions and don't get me wrong. That's great. It's a step for sure, but it's not enough just to create the position. It's also kind of strange to me that what I see often from my colleagues is how much pushback they get from trying to implement change there.

You know, it's like you created this position, you said it was important. You're paying this person, but you don't want to implement the changes. Because change is hard. People don't want to do it. And with this conversation, largely it goes back to most people, AKA cis-gender people have not had to do this before and they kind of don't want to, they don't see it as necessary.

And if we want to get, you know, psychological with it here for a minute, I think subconsciously when you're a member of a group that holds power, of a dominant group. So for example, cis-gender people, some people, whether they realize it or not, don't want to participate in inclusion, for example, asserting pronouns because they haven't had to do it before.

And there's this resistance because. If I start doing it, this thing that I don't have to do, and I've never had to do before. Am I losing some of that power that I inherently hold? Am I giving that power to other people? No. You're not, you know, I'm going to borrow a line from a colleague of mine. It's a myth that there is a finite amount of resources out there and a finite amount of power out there.

So even if you're cis-gender and even if you think it should be obvious what your pronouns are. You asserting them, isn't giving up any power. You're actually using your power to champion it for everybody else who doesn't have it that easily. Now here's another point of their resistance. For example, an executive saying, could we really have to do this?

It illustrates an important part of inclusion, which is if you don't actually believe in what you're doing and you're not on board with. If you try to do it, it's going to feel inauthentic. So you're not going to want to do it. Like when I think about that person saying, do we really have to do this whole pronoun thing?

I think of it as like, why am I advocating for this if I don't actually think it matters? Not that that's okay. Right. I mean, That's a problematic standpoint, but I think it's one that a lot of people out there have, especially members of dominant groups. White people, cisgender people, heterosexual people, right?

Why do I have to do this? If I don't actually think it matters?

So, you know, wall, I can't force anyone to think that it matters. What I can do. And what I'm trying to do is to open up people's minds as to why it matters. Even if it doesn't directly matter to you, it certainly matters to people out there. And if you're advocating for it, you are elevating those people.

Tricky. It's tricky when people don't want to do that. Now another thing that I hear a lot is people will site they're like, okay, well this whole pronoun thing, like, here's the thing. I just really don't know that much about the trans community or the transgender community. So like, that's why I shy away from it.

Just cause I don't know. Not knowing about something doesn't give you exemption from it. Right. That doesn't work. Get in the know, and here's the other thing you don't have to know. Well, let me go back even further. One, as I've said, pronouns are not a trans thing. They're not a gender nonconforming thing, and we all have pronouns.

We all use them and you don't have to really know much about diverse genders in order to be able to practice a supportive behavior. Right. Even if you're like, oh, I just don't get all the nuances of gender. And like, it's just, whoa, I don't get it all. You don't have to. All that you have to know is asking someone how they want to be referred to.

Here's the other thing, sometimes people are just outright like, well, I don't actually support gender non-conforming people, so I don't want to do this thing that helps them out. That one's tough. Certainly if you're in an employment setting, that's something to be addressed. And how does that align or not with your company's values and mission statement, and just always keep in your back pocket.

If somebody tries to be like, well, you can't make me change my personal beliefs. Hey, no one's asking you to, you can believe what ever you want. What we're talking about here is behavior. And here are some that you can't do and see, or here are some that we expect you to do. You can hold onto your beliefs that you want now also from family members and loved ones of particularly trans non binary and gender nonconforming people.

What I've heard a lot from parents it's and it's coming from in a weird way. It's coming from a, they think they're being helpful and they think they're being supportive and they're trying to be protective of the. Child or family member, but I've heard people say like, okay, my loved one has told me what their pronouns are, but I'm not quite sure that I'm on board with it yet.

And like, I don't know what they are either. So what if they change their mind? And I'm not sure I want to be like using this new pronoun that they've asked to me because I like co-signing that identity when I'm not sure that's who they actually are. So let's say that someone quote, unquote changes their mind.

That's not actually how I see it, but that's what I hear a lot. What if they change their mind? What if this doesn't stick? What if it's just a phase? Right. So let's just go with that for a second. So if somebody changes their mind, AKA changes their pronoun somewhere along the way, which is totally okay to do at any given point.

If you are a family member or a loved one or a coworker colleague friend, if you're interfacing with anyone who tells you what their pronouns are by properly, gendering them along the way you're demonstrating to them, that you respect them, that you care about them, that you are willing to do that you have also modeled for them that you're going to honor whatever their pronouns are.

So let's just go with what if they change, right. If it did change somewhere along the way that person's going to likely feel more safe and comfortable to share that with you. And even if that happens along the way, you've demonstrated support to them because the alternative is. You don't do that. You disrespect them.

You tell them they have no, you inadvertently tell them that their human dignity doesn't matter. And that they, as a person don't matter and you're doing harm along the way. So best practice here is even if you are working on being accepting and supportive of someone in your life, who's going by different pronouns than they have in the past.

Best practice here is you still demonstrate supportive behavior by using that pronoun, even if you don't get it, even if it feels weird to you, even if it feels uncomfortable to you, you still practice it by using their pronoun, their pronoun, the one that they have told you that they use.

Now, again, the implication here is that if you take some time to understand where that person's coming from, it will hopefully matter to you more and it will feel more authentic to use them to use the pronouns that they're asking of you. If you get stuck in your own head about like, what you think is right.

And what you think is okay, it's, you've now made it about yourself and not about them.

Now what to do, if you mess up, if you use the wrong pronoun, which is also referred to as mis-gendering someone mis-gendering, someone can cause harm, whether it's intentional or not. So if you do it, it's really important to take some steps to correct yourself. You want to correct yourself and move on.

Don't make a big deal out of it, right? It might call more attention to it. Then that person wants. And oftentimes what happens is the person who is mis-gendered, it often falls on them to try to make the other person to feel better about it. Right. So here's how it can often play out somebody mis-gender someone in the moment, and then they realize it and they have their own reaction to it.

Right. So right after mis-gendering someone. Don't forget to get his book. Uh, I mean her book. Oh my gosh. I'm so sorry. I swear. I've been trying really hard and I've been trying to practice, and this is just like also hard for me, but I love you and I respect you and I totally support the trans community, and all of a sudden you've made it this big, huge deal, and you've made it about yourself and then cut to the other person's on the other end.

And what are they supposed to do? I mean, probably in their head, they're like, yeah, do better. But oftentimes how it plays out is that person feeling inclined to be. No. It's okay. I can see you're trying, I appreciate that too. Like don't put somebody in that type of position for them to make you feel better after you've just caused harm to them, not meaning to.

I always recommend for people. Don't, don't talk about if the process is hard for you and if you're struggling and you're working on it and all those things, and if you're like, you know, it's just so hard. Cause I've known you as this person for so long. And I feel a sense of loss there and you know, all of those things, I'm not saying that's not valid.

I'm saying, don't say those things to that person. That's a lot for somebody to take on and that's your stuff for them to take on what they shouldn't have to. So instead find a separate space to process that out. Right. So if you mis-gender someone that, you know, you correct yourself, you move on and then later you can have that conversation with somebody else in your life.

I accidentally mis-gendered so-and-so and this is why it was so hard for me and why I'm having a struggle with it. You can get that out and you can process that, but don't do it to that person because meanwhile, that person. I mean, like I'm trying to celebrate this and I'm trying to like, feel myself for this.

Like, I don't really want to have to caretake to you right now. Um, the other thing is do it in the moment. Don't let the moment pass. I've been there. You know, I'll totally own, it's really important for me to own as someone who is championing this, I accidentally mis-gender people sometimes. And it's really important to me to acknowledge that when it happens in the moment, because if you don't.

Cause it's like, here's what happens. It happens. And you're like, oh shoot. I just mis-gendered somebody. Should I say, should I not? If you miss the moment, you're communicating things by not saying anything. You're communicating that it's not a safe space. That if somebody messes up and gets mis-gendered, it won't be corrected.

That is not establishing safety. You've also made it more about yourself. It's like, oops, I messed up, but I don't want to call myself out. So I'm not going to say anything, you know, rather than if it happens, you acknowledge it. You're showing that person that it's something that you realized and that even if you're uncomfortable with doing so, you want to atone for it and you want to apologize for it.

If for whatever reason, the moment passed, or maybe it didn't feel appropriate for whatever reason. Follow up later with that person, you know, name what happened. Hey, I realized that I mis-gendered you and I'm sorry, my bad. Now, if you're in a group setting and someone gets mis-gendered by somebody else, again, practice in that moment, correcting it in real time.

Because first of all, for someone who's trans non binary or gender nonconforming, it's a lot to have to constantly be correcting people while they practice with your new pronouns. That's just a lot to like help somebody out by not always having it beyond them. It's also not always a comfortable thing to do to correct for yourself.

So it can be really nice to have somebody else say, actually, it's he. Right? And so. This one can be tricky too, because all of this stuff happens in the moment where you're like, oh shoot. I don't like, I don't want to call that person out or are they going to be embarrassed? I've been in, in this position, I've had it happen where like my bosses have mis-gendered people and I've been like, it's they/them.

You know? And is it a little awkward for, you know, to do that? Yes. Is that being awkward for me more important than someone being respected? No. Right. So like, I can certainly take on having some discomfort and having to correct someone because that's how important it is. And it's way more important than me having my own reaction to it.

And to be honest, the more I've done it through the years, the easier it's gotten. And especially like, if you think about why you're doing it, You're not doing it to call that person out. You're not doing it to embarrass that person. You're doing that so that everyone in the room can be respected if you don't do it.

You're also kind of like, people notice it, even if no one brings attention to it, it's not like no one noticed that it happened. And so. Uh, subconsciously or, or maybe even they're realizing it sometimes they're like, oh, somebody just used the wrong pronoun for that person. And no one said anything. So I guess that means when stuff happens in here, that's not okay.

It's not going to get addressed, whether it's gender related or not like that does not foster a safe environment. When you're like, I saw something right now that just happened. That was wrong. And no one did anything about it. Not cool. So it, it happens in a group setting. It usually what I'll do is I'll just correct the person.

So if they're like, this would happen a lot with, if I was having like a meeting with family members and a youth that I was working with in the room, and if the parent would like. Whether realizing it or not would mis-gender that person I would just right there in the moment, correct them if, if they were like, well, you know, he he's just causing so much trouble lately.

She. Just like that. And like, trust me, is that one kind of awkward too? Yes. To say, like, to correct a parent and I've had parents be like, it's my kid and dah, dah, dah, dah. You know? And so again, you're just you model in that model. That. I mean, I don't say this part. It's not about you. I just say I'm doing it to respect your child and to show respect to them.

So we've talked to all about pronouns, what they are, why to use them, how to use them, the importance of using them, the harm that comes with not using them, reflect on all of this. Take the beat and think about like, what are my thoughts and feelings about pronouns? Am I comfortable using them? Do I already use them all the time?

Have I used them somewhat? And I'm going to start doing it more. If there's a part of you big or small, that's still hesitant. Like, if you're like, ah, I mean, like. I hear him and I believe all the things that he's saying, but I still just don't feel comfortable doing it. Check in about why that is. First of all, remember if it is that you're uncomfortable, you can still be uncomfortable and do something at the same time.

In fact, doing something new is supposed to have a level of discomfort to. And when we still do the thing, even though we're uncomfortable, that's how we grow

Now, if you're like, I just don't want to, and I don't think I should have to. I've had people that I've worked with say this to. And at that point, like if I've already gone through all of it, if I've already explained everything and it's not getting in and they still just don't care at that point, I just say, you know, is it worth it to look bad?

Like, cause the bottom line is, if you don't do it, you're not being inclusive. And it reads that way, especially in professional settings and it does not look good. And usually with those people that are really resistant, that's where I'll get the like, okay. Right. Even if the underlying in their head, if they're like rolling their eyes and do we really have to do this once we can get to the bottom line, Hey, this doesn't look good.

Right. And that's one thing about business owners. They know the bottom line and they want to advance their company and not do things that are going to cause harm to it. So, Hey, if that's the only way to get the in to start, I will go there. If I need to

Now, hopefully hearing some of these things today, you're feeling more inclined to do it. I want you to be like, okay, you know what? This is important. And I believe him. And some of these things I haven't thought about before, and I can do this, even if I'm uncomfortable with it, I can do it. And darn it. I will try because I want to support inclusion.

Holla! Go for it. Here are some ways to do that one. This is a really easy one. I think that we talked about had your pronouns to your zoom meeting, or however you virtually meet at your job. It's so easy to do double click on your name and you edit your name. You know, sometimes I put mine in parentheses.

Sometimes I just do as is either Eric or Eric Sullivan. And then I put he/him after it. It's super easy. That's a great way to get started, especially like, while you're getting your bearings with it and getting your comfort with it. You're showing to people, Hey, I made an effort to do that. Next level include your pronouns.

The next time somebody asks you what your name is the next time you have to introduce your self to someone include your pronouns. And just reminder, you can just say what they are after. You can say, I use blank pronouns. You can say, I go by blank pronouns. But for me, what I like the best is I like when people just kind of simply stated, I like, when they just say my name is so-and-so blank pronouns, my name is Eric, he/him pronouns.

When people do it that way, it kind of like shows to me. I'm like, oh, cool. They do this all the time. Right. It's so just casual to them next level up. Consider asking somebody else for their pronouns. This can be a little tricky in the beginning when you haven't done it before, but I promise the more you do it, the easier it gets.

So if I say to somebody, Hey, what's up, I'm Eric. he/him pronouns. And if they don't say anything back, I'll say, how about you? What, what is your name and pronouns? So remember asking for pronouns, basic sign of human respect. It helps to refer to someone accurately and it supports inclusion. So go out there and practice. You've got this.

(Outro)

Thank you so much for hanging out with me today. If you're feeling inspired by today's ep, help your boy out by subscribing to the show and leaving a review. To learn more about how I can guide you through your Queer glow up head over to Be Proud With Eric dot com and remember, always be proud of who you are.

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